George Floyd

Discussion in 'General Politics' started by tabascocat, May 28, 2020.

  1. tabascocat

    tabascocat Well-Known Member

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    Wow, I can’t even comprehend this. I bleed blue more than most but this is inexcusable. All four cops are complicit, three as accessories and one as murder. It doesn’t get any clearer that this was incompetence, abuse of power and homicide.

    I don’t even need to see how he got on the ground and don’t need to either. None of that matters, he was in cuffs with no resisting. It was over, put him in the car. There has to be swift justice here or this will be very bad for peace officers for a long time.

    I am at a loss for words and can’t imagine any officer being that stupid.......white cop digging his knee in a black mans neck who is pleading for help all the while being filmed. Use some darn common sense!
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2020
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  2. cml750

    cml750 Well-Known Member

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    I have avoided the news for the most part for a while other than clicking on a few links on the few forums I visit and listening to the Bongino podcast. I have not seen this one yet. If it is the way you describe it I will agree with you. I will try to find the video this evening. I am at work now and all types of video and audio streams are blocked.
     
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  3. speedkilz88

    speedkilz88 Well-Known Member

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    I've refrained from posting it but will now. It's horrible. The cops seem oblivious to what they are doing. Which doesn't make sense because obviously sitting on a man's neck can do what it ended up doing - cop was also putting all his weight on that knee. I don't understand why none of these cops had the sense to say, ok that's enough let's get him in the car.

    note- there are two more officers on top of him behind the squad car

     
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  4. JoeKing

    JoeKing Well-Known Member

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    Dan Bongino said just about the exact same thing. Once the cuffs are on, it's game over, put him in the car. This was a clear case of abuse of power, but I'm not so sure about the incompetence. That cop knew exactly what he was doing and did it anyway. It was just flat out murder and the other cops are accessories just as you said.

    The wheels of justice turn slow but they are turning in this case. The protest that is really a riot is so unnecessary. Tearing up and burning your own neighborhood doesn't accomplish anything and many just use it as an excuse for looting. Call me cold-hearted but I don't feel bad for these people that lose their minds like this. I see the crime that happened and I feel the injustice in it but the reaction is blown out of proportion IMO. The cops involved have been fired and they aren't going anywhere. Investigations on the local and federal levels are underway. It's time to let the system work but these people don't trust the system and don't have the patience for it. They want to trail this case by the camera and have instant justice. It just does not work that way, folks in a civilized society. I don't blame them at all for being angry but it's when we act on that anger that everyone loses. The whole damn thing is just sad to me. I'm going to pray for everyone today. And that's what these rioters should have done, but too many in this world today don't have the Lord in their hearts so they do the devil's bidding when times get too touch, just like this. :(
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2020
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  5. speedkilz88

    speedkilz88 Well-Known Member

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  6. Robbie

    Robbie Well-Known Member

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    It is horrible what happened to that man. The police officers at fault should be executed.

    But what is with this jungle fever that takes over afterwards? These racist blacks are doing 10,000 times as much harm and damage to our society. They should all be fully prosecuted and put behind bars for years.

    I dare any of them to come near me, my family, or my property.
     
  7. JoeKing

    JoeKing Well-Known Member

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    There isn't enough space in our prisons for these thugs. It's not just in Minnesota, these thugs are nationwide in the urban areas. BLM used this event in Minneapolis to riot in Los Angeles. They and the left stream media call it a protest but when you are stopping traffic and smashing patrol car windows, it's no longer just a protest.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2020
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  8. cml750

    cml750 Well-Known Member

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    After seeing the video, yea these cops should charged with murder (for the guy with the knee on his neck) and accessory to murder for the rest of them. There is absolutely zero reason for them to do that. Once the cuffs were on it should have been over.
     
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  9. JoeKing

    JoeKing Well-Known Member

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    In response to the destruction of business in Minneapolis, black gun owners stand guard in St Paul. This is so good to see, the 2nd Amendment in action.

     
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  10. JoeKing

    JoeKing Well-Known Member

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    The riots have spread to New York City, Los Angeles, Denver, Phoenix, and Memphis.
     
  11. tabascocat

    tabascocat Well-Known Member

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    Some are screaming to kill the white people :(
     
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  12. Robbie

    Robbie Well-Known Member

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    I dare em to start trying.
     
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  13. tabascocat

    tabascocat Well-Known Member

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    Yea, that would be a bad move. I am going to start carrying a little .380 here in LA. I can’t get a LTC here but I don’t care :p
     
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  14. Robbie

    Robbie Well-Known Member

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    If you don’t loot and burn down your own businesses in your own neighborhoods.....you ain’t black!
     
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  15. Kevinicus

    Kevinicus Well-Known Member

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    This has of course been all over social media the last few days, and I've resisted commenting on it. It's been difficult, because of all of the misinformation and logical fallacies that I've seen flying around. But, I also know that if I did express my thoughts, people would react from emotion, not really listen to what I said, throw out some strawmen and just start attacking me and wishing ill will on me and my family. Sorta like any other political matter on social media.

    When I watched the main video, I had my doubts going in. I was hearing the "he shouted he couldn't breathe" story again, and was wanting to roll my eyes. Early on in the video, I was thinking, that's probably not the best place for your knee, but the guy does seem like he's doing okay. He wasn't just saying he couldn't breathe, he was yelling it with some force, repeatedly, and mixed in with other phrases as well. He didn't sound like he was wheezing or struggling for air at all. I had believed the saying, "if you can talk, you can breathe," which I have since learned isn't completely true (However, they mention some capacity to talk, it's unclear how much - with how much yelling etc. was coming from Floyd, I still have serious doubts that he actually couldn't breathe). However, I think, even if Floyd could breathe perfectly fine, the pressure from the knee on the neck could be problematic and cut off oxygen to the brain. My concern over the breathing line was just a matter of accuracy, and wondering if cops should necessarily ease up because someone makes a claim of distress. I don't believe it is black and white, and that all anyone should have to do is make a claim if they want to get the police to ease up. I think all situations have to be considered differently based on various factors (apparent health and/or strength of the suspect, struggle being put forth, their history of violence/running/resisting - if known, etc.).

    As the video went on, it became pretty clear the guy wasn't struggling too much, and it just continued to drag on. It was like, "Okay, what the hell are you guys waiting for?" There's no apparent need to keep him forced to the ground, and you have to know that pressure on someone's neck for that long can't be good for them. Floyd was obviously not struggling that much, if the cop didn't even need to use his arms (and as was seen in a picture, there were 2 others out of view also restraining him), and could engage with those pleading with him. I'm still willing to wait for additional footage (it is my understanding that the body cams were operating), but I am unable to imagine anything at this point that would justify in any way the extent that these officers went to.

    I understand the calls for murder (I'm not sure that's the correct term. I read some of the Minnesota statutes, and wasn't sure if it would fall under Manslaughter of the 2nd degree, or Murder in the 3rd. I'm not a lawyer, so what is intended by the phrasing used isn't 100% clear to me). However, there is a process that has to be done. Any additional footage needs to be examined, the medical examination has to be done (is it possible there was some other health issue at play?), etc. They may even be trying to determine what the actual charge(s) should be (Are they going back and forth on the statutes like I am?).

    Unfortunately, there is an assumption that anything bad that happens has to be because of race. Which really irritates me. If the only thing that can be pointed to that indicates this was a race based incident is that Floyd was black and the cop (at least the one on the neck) was white, then that implies that it is impossible for a white person and a black person to have any interaction that is not race based. And that is an absurdity. So now, we have a huge swath of social media making flat out stupid arguments about race and comparing random incidents with many different variables as if everything else was the same except race. And then there's another huge swath virtue signaling, making equally stupid arguments so they can try and pretend they're down with the plight, while anyone that has a calm and reasoned opinion is just staying quiet because everyone is so eager to lash out and call anyone who isn't 100% in lockstep a racist.

    You're not allowed to look at each case individually. And you're not allowed to look at anything with any perspective that isn't centered on race. If you think the cop(s) are guilty of murder, but don't necessarily see that it's a race thing (not discounting it as a possibility, but just not assuming either), that's not good enough. Even thinking it just might be possible that the cop(s) were just stupid, arrogant, idiots who were on a power trip that made them reckless is unforgivable. Every thing they do must be about race. Because, obviously, other races never have bad outcomes with cops either. Only one group.

    And, of course, the idea that cops are human, and are just as capable of committing crimes as the rest of society, is a non-starter. Nope, one incident happens, and no matter the result, even if a full on murder conviction, there is nothing that would be satisfactory, so let's protest. No, that's not good enough either, let's riot. Let's loot, and be all sorts of lawless. Let's destroy ourselves. What's the goal? I've seen some say, "To get their attention." Who? Target? Autozone? You may get their attention, but they're going to want nothing to do with you or your concerns (valid or not) after that. It's sickening that some defend the behavior of these people doing these things the last couple of days. They jump through hoops with mental gymnastics, because critical thinking and consideration of other perspectives would be too difficult.

    Too much emotion, not enough brains.

    Just my .02 (I kind of petered out there towards the end - it's an exhausting situation and I'm already sick of it).
     
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  16. tabascocat

    tabascocat Well-Known Member

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    I won’t argue against this novel because I agree with most of it. But, the knee on the neck isn’t about breathing. Pressure on the carotid artery stops blood going to the brain, heart and lungs resulting in low blood O2. That would make someone feel like they can’t breathe. Only one artery was blocked so that is why he didn’t pass out for 8 minutes, his brain and heart were slowly dying. I would bet that he died from cardiac arrest once an autopsy comes out, that is most likely the COD.
     
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  17. Kevinicus

    Kevinicus Well-Known Member

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    I agree with all of that (from a non medical person). I never felt breathing was the issue. And it's why I cringe at the "He said he couldn't breathe!" that gets thrown around, often in headlines.
     
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  18. tabascocat

    tabascocat Well-Known Member

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    I am just speculating on the COD but is my best guess not being a medical examiner. There could be a number of reasons such as brain damage, pre-existing conditions, etc. The restricted blood-flow was unnecessary and anyone with some common sense can see that. That officer really screwed up and should pay the ultimate price.

    Certainly, the rioting(anarchy) is taking everything away......it accomplishes nothing and even further divides race relations. That 65” TV doesn’t help Floyd........
     
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  19. JoeKing

    JoeKing Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for that post. I think you said something very pithy there at the end that describes the liberal mindset to a T, "Too much emotion, not enough brains". Have no doubt, the police brutality/murder case of George Floyd will find justice, in the end. But the abundance of these with "too much emotion, too little brains" will still exist. We've seen it time and time again. Letting it fester night after night is not the answer. Understand, there are anarchists in this country that are in business to take tragedies like this and turn them to their advantage by maximizing anger in the community, damage to local businesses, and control the narrative with blanket statements about who was doing the wrongdoing and who was victimized. Giving the anarchist time, they will do all the things and you will be powerless to stop it. These are outsiders that have no interest in peaceful outcomes or maintaining law and order. A terrible injustice was committed to George Floyd, no doubt about it. It's being rectified as quickly as possible by the authorities. It will take time and patience.

    Meanwhile, the anger is justified but that can not be allowed to turn into the riots that continue to happen. That is a result of liberal leaders allowing anarchists to take over. These riots should have been put down the first day. Don't give the outsiders time to come to town and take over. The national guard should have been on the ground the next day for crowd control purposes. The police should never be given orders by the liberal leaders to abandon their police stations. Liberal cities with liberal leaders and liberal policies allow these results time after time. It was a powder keg waiting to explode. Do you remember when Obama said elections have consequences? These are the consequences of liberal policies, by liberal leaders in liberal cities. The anarchists prevail, and the liberal media cling on to the anarchist blanket message... police bad, white man bad, orange man in the white house bad.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2020
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  20. Kevinicus

    Kevinicus Well-Known Member

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    I think I was right, seeing as he was charged with both 3rd degree murder and manslaughter. In addition to having to analyze all the evidence, get medical determination, talk to witnesses, etc, they likely weren't sure on which charge they wanted to apply. So, I think it's likely they went with both to see which one would stick (I wouldn't think they could be convicted concurrently for the same victim - but I dunno).
     

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